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The House Jan 6 hearings must result in some criminal charges.  Merrick Garland must do something or the hearings were just about politics.
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13 hours ago, bludog said:
The House Jan 6 hearings must result in some criminal charges.  Merrick Garland must do something or the hearings were just about politics.

 

 

The problem is that the Democrats have spent so much time worrying about making the Right angry, that they didn't see that their own base is really angry.

 

BTW, interesting factoid.  West Virginia has a lower life expectancy than Bangladesh.

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23 hours ago, LoreD said:

The problem is that the Democrats have spent so much time worrying about making the Right angry, that they didn't see that their own base is really angry.

Very true. The Democratic Party has become known for a lack of spine.

 

The reason behind it i that since most Democratic lawmakers take legalized bribes from ultra-wealthy, pro-Trump corporations and individuals, they dare not bite the hand that feeds them.  This causes their anti-Trump protests to be weak and ineffectual.

 

Under current laws encouraging corruption, these corporate Democrats care less about votes than large infusions of cash.  They figure correctly, that most of the time, a hefty war chest will win more votes than an running an  honest campaign.

 

To preserve Democracy, we need Campaign Finance and Lobbying Reform.

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23 hours ago, LoreD said:

BTW, interesting factoid.  West Virginia has a lower life expectancy than Bangladesh

 

Sad but true.  It is a testament to the power of disinformation and brainwashing which causes people to value conspiracy theories and wedge issues like gun rights and control of women's bodies, over the health and welfare of themselves and their loved ones. 

 

It is a culture of death.

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9 hours ago, bludog said:

 

Sad but true.  It is a testament to the power of disinformation and brainwashing which causes people to value conspiracy theories and wedge issues like gun rights and control of women's bodies, over the health and welfare of themselves and their loved ones. 

 

It is a culture of death.

 

 

The distraction campaign by the Far Right goes way back.  Don't worry about your, and your children's, teeth rotting due to malnutrition and lack of dental care.  Worry about two guys getting married in San Francisco.

 

The Far Right has convinced these people that these social issues are more important than their family's health and prosperity.

 

I remember when Diane Sawyer did a special about the poverty and suffering of the people in WV.  After the show was aired; Right Wingers came out and talked about how much they admired the "proud and independent" people who would let their children starve and their teeth rot, rather than ask "big government" for help. 

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5 hours ago, LoreD said:

The distraction campaign by the Far Right goes way back.  Don't worry about your, and your children's, teeth rotting due to malnutrition and lack of dental care.  Worry about two guys getting married in San Francisco.

Although lying, from the top down, began in antiquity, when people were first divided into rulers and subjects, it was conceived of as a science by Joseph Goebbels, minister of propaganda for the Nazi Party.  The Republican Party took Goebbels precepts, honing and refining them even further.  The Republican contribution is that Big Lies need to enlarge on hates and prejudices already present in the target group.

 

Goebbels concept of The Big Lie (große Lüge) has been employed to brainwash perhaps a third of the American people to the point that they would gladly lay down the lives of their loved ones in defense of lies about minority groups which make them to feel superior.  Considering that everything else has been taken from them, the lies of racial, sexist and cultural superiority are all they have left. 

 

And that's the goal:---  Take away everything they have and leave them with nothing but worthless lies.  That's Plutocracy in action.

 

 

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2 hours ago, bludog said:

Although lying, from the top down, began in antiquity, when people were first divided into rulers and subjects, it was conceived of as a science by Joseph Goebbels, minister of propaganda for the Nazi Party.  The Republican Party took Goebbels precepts, honing and refining them even further.  The Republican contribution is that Big Lies need to enlarge on hates and prejudices already present in the target group.

 

Goebbels concept of The Big Lie (große Lüge) has been employed to brainwash perhaps a third of the American people to the point that they would gladly lay down the lives of their loved ones in defense of lies about minority groups which make them to feel superior.  Considering that everything else has been taken from them, the lies of racial, sexist and cultural superiority are all they have left. 

 

And that's the goal:---  Take away everything they have and leave them with nothing but worthless lies.  That's Plutocracy in action.

 

 

Hello Bluedog.-sorry about our bitter divorce.. but like you said.. it was bound to happen.. you in the liberal forum.. and oh well-me the conservative room LOLOLOL ta ta.

.lololol

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3 hours ago, SootedUpCyndi said:

Hello Bluedog.-sorry about our bitter divorce.. but like you said.. it was bound to happen.. you in the liberal forum.. and oh well-me the conservative room LOLOLOL ta ta.

.lololol

 

Ha ha ha ha ha.  That was one of Elvis' best numbers

 

Yes our online divorce😄 could have been less messy.  Then again, we had a marriage made on Mars:).  In orbit, actually😄.  It always amazes me that bipartisan couple Mary Matalin and James Caraville never untied the knot.  But they're the exception to the rule.

 

Well, all good things must come to an end. 😂 🤣😂  It was fun while it lasted.

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7 hours ago, bludog said:

Although lying, from the top down, began in antiquity, when people were first divided into rulers and subjects, it was conceived of as a science by Joseph Goebbels, minister of propaganda for the Nazi Party.  The Republican Party took Goebbels precepts, honing and refining them even further.  The Republican contribution is that Big Lies need to enlarge on hates and prejudices already present in the target group.

 

Goebbels concept of The Big Lie (große Lüge) has been employed to brainwash perhaps a third of the American people to the point that they would gladly lay down the lives of their loved ones in defense of lies about minority groups which make them to feel superior.  Considering that everything else has been taken from them, the lies of racial, sexist and cultural superiority are all they have left. 

 

And that's the goal:---  Take away everything they have and leave them with nothing but worthless lies.  That's Plutocracy in action.

 

 

 

 

Most of this has been recycled since the 1930's, and probably farther back:

 

 

 

The American Liberty League was an American political organization formed in 1934. Its membership consisted primarily of wealthy business elites and prominent political figures, who were for the most part conservatives opposed to the New Deal of President Franklin D. Roosevelt. The group emphasized private property and individual liberties. Its leader Jouett Shouse called on members to:

defend and uphold the constitution of the United States ... to teach the necessity of respect for the rights of persons and property as fundamental to every successful form of government ... teach the duty of government to encourage and protect individual and group initiative and enterprise, to foster the right to work, earn, save, and acquire property, and to preserve the ownership and lawful use of property when acquired.
 
On the national level, the League's total expenditures over its six-year life amounted to $1,200,000, with more than a million of that being spent during its most active months before the 1936 election.[23] Wealthy donors dominated, so that "fewer than two dozen bankers, industrialists, and businessmen" accounted for more than half the League's 1935 monies on the national level, with the du Pont family responsible for 30% of the total. The next year, 30 donors provided two-thirds of the funds and the du Ponts' share of the total exceeded 25%.
 

 

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7 hours ago, bludog said:

Although lying, from the top down, began in antiquity, when people were first divided into rulers and subjects, it was conceived of as a science by Joseph Goebbels, minister of propaganda for the Nazi Party.  The Republican Party took Goebbels precepts, honing and refining them even further.  The Republican contribution is that Big Lies need to enlarge on hates and prejudices already present in the target group.

 

Goebbels concept of The Big Lie (große Lüge) has been employed to brainwash perhaps a third of the American people to the point that they would gladly lay down the lives of their loved ones in defense of lies about minority groups which make them to feel superior.  Considering that everything else has been taken from them, the lies of racial, sexist and cultural superiority are all they have left. 

 

And that's the goal:---  Take away everything they have and leave them with nothing but worthless lies.  That's Plutocracy in action.

 

 

 

 

Why is so little known about the 1930s coup attempt against FDR?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/jan/11/trump-fdr-roosevelt-coup-attempt-1930s

 

 

Business leaders like JP Morgan and Irénée du Pont were accused by a retired major general of plotting to install a fascist dictator

 

Donald Trump’s elaborate plot to overthrow the democratically elected president was neither impulsive nor uncoordinated, but straight out of the playbook of another American coup attempt – the 1933 “Wall Street putsch” against newly elected Franklin Delano Roosevelt.

 

 

A divided country and FDR’s emboldened powerful enemies made the plot to overthrow him seem plausible. With restless uncertainty, volatile protests and ominous threats, America’s right wing was inspired to form its own paramilitary organizations. Militias sprung up throughout the land, their self-described “patriots” chanting: “This is despotism! This is tyranny!”

 

Today’s Proud Boys and Oath Keepers have nothing on their extremist forbears. In 1933, a diehard core of conservative veterans formed the Khaki Shirts in Philadelphia and recruited pro-Mussolini immigrants. The Silver Shirts was an apocalyptic Christian militia patterned on the notoriously racist Texas Rangers that operated in 46 states and stockpiled weapons.

 

The Gray Shirts of New York organized to remove “Communist college professors” from the nation’s education system, and the Tennessee-based White Shirts wore a Crusader cross and agitated for the takeover of Washington. JP Morgan Jr, one of the nation’s richest men, had secured a $100m loan to Mussolini’s government. He defiantly refused to pay income tax and implored his peers to join him in undermining FDR.

 

So, when retired US Marine Corps Maj Gen Smedley Darlington Butler claimed he was recruited by a group of Wall Street financiers to lead a fascist coup against FDR and the US government in the summer of 1933, Washington took him seriously. Butler, a Quaker, and first world war hero dubbed the Maverick Marine, was a soldier’s soldier who was idolized by veterans – which represented a huge and powerful voting bloc in America. Famous for his daring exploits in China and Central America, Butler’s reputation was impeccable. He got rousing ovations when he claimed that during his 33 years in the marines: “I spent most of my time being a high-class muscle man for big business, for Wall Street and for bankers. In short, I was a racketeer for capitalism.”

 

Butler later testified before Congress that a bond-broker and American Legion member named Gerald MacGuire approached him with the plan. MacGuire told him the coup was backed by a group called the American Liberty League, a group of business leaders which formed in response to FDR’s victory, and whose mission it was to teach government “the necessity of respect for the rights of persons and property”. Members included JP Morgan, Jr, Irénée du Pont, Robert Sterling Clark of the Singer sewing machine fortune, and the chief executives of General Motors, Birds Eye and General Foods.

 

The putsch called for him to lead a massive army of veterans – funded by $30m from Wall Street titans and with weapons supplied by Remington Arms – to march on Washington, oust Roosevelt and the entire line of succession, and establish a fascist dictatorship backed by a private army of 500,000.

 

The final report by the congressional committee tasked with investigating the allegations, delivered in February 1935, concluded: “[The committee] received evidence showing that certain persons had made an attempt to establish a fascist organization in this country”, adding “There is no question that these attempts were discussed, were planned, and might have been placed in execution when and if the financial backers deemed it expedient.”

 

As Congressman John McCormack who headed the congressional investigation put it: “If General Butler had not been the patriot he was, and if they had been able to maintain secrecy, the plot certainly might very well have succeeded … When times are desperate and people are frustrated, anything could happen.”

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8 hours ago, bludog said:

 

Ha ha ha ha ha.  That was one of Elvis' best numbers

 

Yes our online divorce😄 could have been less messy.  Then again, we had a marriage made on Mars:).  In orbit, actually😄.  It always amazes me that bipartisan couple Mary Matalin and James Caraville never untied the knot.  But they're the exception to the rule.

 

Well, all good things must come to an end. 😂 🤣😂  It was fun while it lasted.

Just a quick drop in -to say hello. chuckle... haven't seen you in so long.😃

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11 hours ago, LoreD said:

Business leaders like JP Morgan and Irénée du Pont were accused by a retired major general of plotting to install a fascist dictator

 

Donald Trump’s elaborate plot to overthrow the democratically elected president was neither impulsive nor uncoordinated, but straight out of the playbook of another American coup attempt – the 1933 “Wall Street putsch” against newly elected Franklin Delano Roosevelt.

 

Indeed, I did not know about this until now.  It is less surprising than it is edifying.  Today, as back then, the ultra wealthy, resented Democracy, which enables representation of the ordinary person.  The electorate will often vote themselves a piece of the economic pie and to many of the most privileged, that is anathema.

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5 hours ago, bludog said:

 

Indeed, I did not know about this until now.  It is less surprising than it is edifying.  Today, as back then, the ultra wealthy, resented Democracy, which enables representation of the ordinary person.  The electorate will often vote themselves a piece of the economic pie and to many of the most privileged, that is anathema.

 

 

These groups just keep resurfacing as a newly named group.  The Liberty League disbanded and reformed as The John Birch Society, became the Tea Party, and then became MAGA.  There are probably a few groups in between that I don't remember, but it shows the same old fascist groups keep coming back.

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22 minutes ago, LoreD said:

These groups just keep resurfacing as a newly named group.  The Liberty League disbanded and reformed as The John Birch Society, became the Tea Party, and then became MAGA.  There are probably a few groups in between that I don't remember, but it shows the same old fascist groups keep coming back.

 

Good connecting of the dots.  I never thought of it that way, but it rings true.

 

In the category of  "friend of the Ordinary People", FDR was the greatest president we ever had.  In the 1930s, under FDR, the US set the example for all the other Social Democracies which followed:---  New Zealand, Singapore, The Scandinavian countries, The Netherlands, Belgium, Canada, et al.  If only FDR's vision had proved more durable in the USA.

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3 minutes ago, bludog said:

 

Good connecting of the dots.  I never thought of it that way, but it rings true.

 

In the category of  "friend of the Ordinary People", FDR was the greatest president we ever had.  In the 1930s, under FDR, the US set the example for all the other Social Democracies which followed:---  New Zealand, Singapore, The Scandinavian countries, The Netherlands, Belgium, Canada, et al.  If only FDR's vision had proved more durable in the USA.

 

 

The Second Bill of Rights was proposed by United States President Franklin D. Roosevelt 

1:35
President Franklin D. Roosevelt announced the plan for a bill of social and economic rights in the State of the Union address of January 11, 1944 (filmed excerpt).
 
 

It is our duty now to begin to lay the plans and determine the strategy for the winning of a lasting peace and the establishment of an American standard of living higher than ever before known. We cannot be content, no matter how high that general standard of living may be, if some fraction of our people—whether it be one-third or one-fifth or one-tenth—is ill-fed, ill-clothed, ill-housed, and insecure.

 

This Republic had its beginning, and grew to its present strength, under the protection of certain inalienable political rights—among them the right of free speech, free press, free worship, trial by jury, freedom from unreasonable searches and seizures. They were our rights to life and liberty.

 

As our nation has grown in size and stature, however—as our industrial economy expanded—these political rights proved inadequate to assure us equality in the pursuit of happiness.

 

We have come to a clear realization of the fact that true individual freedom cannot exist without economic security and independence. "Necessitous men are not free men."[8] People who are hungry and out of a job are the stuff of which dictatorships are made.

 

In our day these economic truths have become accepted as self-evident. We have accepted, so to speak, a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all—regardless of station, race, or creed.

Among these are:

All of these rights spell security. And after this war is won we must be prepared to move forward, in the implementation of these rights, to new goals of human happiness and well-being.

 

America's own rightful place in the world depends in large part upon how fully these and similar rights have been carried into practice for all our citizens. For unless there is security here at home there cannot be lasting peace in the world.

 

 

 

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10 hours ago, MackTheFinger said:

Go back to where you came from !

Finger got so plastered he didn't know where he was again.

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18 hours ago, LoreD said:

The Second Bill of Rights was proposed by United States President Franklin D. Roosevelt 

 if only FDR's predecessors had believed in and fought for his Second Bill of Rights, we would live in a better country today.  At one time, I displayed the Second Bill of Rights as my sig. 

 

Today, FDRs Second Bill of Rights are not inactive.    Right now, in 2022, the Social Democracies of the world operate on those same principles   Their original inspiration came from FDR back in the 1930s.

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2 hours ago, bludog said:

 if only FDR's predecessors had believed in and fought for his Second Bill of Rights, we would live in a better country today.  At one time, I displayed the Second Bill of Rights as my sig. 

 

Today, FDRs Second Bill of Rights are not inactive.    Right now, in 2022, the Social Democracies of the world operate on those same principles   Their original inspiration came from FDR back in the 1930s.

 

 

Democrats Aren’t Moving Left. They’re Returning to Their Roots.

Many on both sides are worried about the party’s leftward swing. They say it’s a deviation from the mainstream. It’s not.

 

 

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/11/04/elections-2018-democrats-history-liberal-progressive-socialist-222187/

 

Truman strongly supported single-payer health care. Moynihan supported a universal basic income in the 1960s. Dating back to World War II, Democrats sought to make a government-paid education available to as many Americans as possible. If Democrats are marching to the left, that road leads directly back to platforms and politicians who, in their day, commanded wide support and existed firmly in the mainstream of political thought.

 

What’s more, to label these programs “socialist”—which is to say, far outside the center of the political spectrum—reveals a constrained worldview. For over six decades, center-right parties in Europe—in Britain and France, Germany and Austria, and almost everywhere between—have either participated in or acceded to the very same policies.

 

In the 1940s, Senators Robert Wagner and James Murray and Congressman John Dingell Sr. introduced legislation that would have established a national program for hospital and medical insurance. It was stymied by a coalition of Southern Democrats and conservative Republicans, as was also the case with Truman’s efforts after 1949 to achieve the same result. But it was central to the party’s core ambition for many years after.

 

It’s also ahistorical to decry such policies as “socialist.” To be sure, conservative critics have used the term for the better part of 80 years. In 1936, the chairman of the Republican National Committee warned that America was on a path to become “a socialistic state honeycombed with waste and extravagance and ruled by a dictatorship that mocks the rights of the States and the liberty of the citizen.” In 1952, during his campaign for the presidency, Dwight D. Eisenhower, a relative moderate in the Republican Party, denounced universal health care as “socialized medicine.” In 1961, while speaking on the circuit as a representative of General Electric, Ronald Reagan warned that a pared-down proposal to provide guaranteed hospital insurance for senior citizens constituted “a short step to all the rest of socialism.” “If you and I don’t do this,” he implored his audience, “then you and I may well spend our sunset years telling our children’s children what it was once like in America when men were free.” (Remembering Reagan’s days as an FDR and Truman Democrat, a liberal skeptic asked him, “How much are they paying you for this shit?”)

 

In Europe, most of what we know today as the Democratic Party’s “progressive agenda” is normative. It’s the bare minimum of a social contract that enjoys wide support from conservatives, socialists and centrists alike.

 

 

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On 6/17/2022 at 9:01 AM, bludog said:
The House Jan 6 hearings must result in some criminal charges.  Merrick Garland must do something or the hearings were just about politics.

 

This tells it all:

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2022/6/21/2105302/-Cartoon-The-guilty-party?detail=emaildkre&pm_source=DKRE&pm_medium=email

 

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1 hour ago, bludog said:

 

 

Apparently, people have been paying attention:

 

6 in 10 Americans say Trump should be charged for Jan. 6 riot: POLL

A majority of Americans also think the Jan. 6 committee has been fair.

 

The poll divides along party lines, with 91% of Democrats thinking Trump should be charged with a crime compared to 19% of Republicans. On whether Trump bears a "great deal" or a "good amount" of responsibility for the attack, 91% of Democrats and 21% of Republicans say he does.

 

Among self-described independents, 62% think Trump should be charged and 61% think he bears a "great deal" or a "good amount" of responsibility.

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36 minutes ago, LoreD said:

 

 

Apparently, people have been paying attention:

 

6 in 10 Americans say Trump should be charged for Jan. 6 riot: POLL

A majority of Americans also think the Jan. 6 committee has been fair.

 

The poll divides along party lines, with 91% of Democrats thinking Trump should be charged with a crime compared to 19% of Republicans. On whether Trump bears a "great deal" or a "good amount" of responsibility for the attack, 91% of Democrats and 21% of Republicans say he does.

 

Among self-described independents, 62% think Trump should be charged and 61% think he bears a "great deal" or a "good amount" of responsibility.

 

Public opinion notwithstanding, it all comes down to whether Merrick Garland has the courage to bring appropriate charges.  Garland and his family probably won't get many death threats for doing nothing.  If he chooses to do his duty and bring serious charges, he and everyone connected with the prosecution will need to be closely guarded.  Let's hope he doesn't betray the Constitution and the People of the USA.

 

Penalty for treason:---   Under U.S. Code Title 18, the penalty is death, or not less than five years' imprisonment.   Any person convicted of treason against the United States also forfeits the right to hold public office in the United States.

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On 6/21/2022 at 6:29 PM, bludog said:

 

Public opinion notwithstanding, it all comes down to whether Merrick Garland has the courage to bring appropriate charges.  Garland and his family probably won't get many death threats for doing nothing.  If he chooses to do his duty and bring serious charges, he and everyone connected with the prosecution will need to be closely guarded.  Let's hope he doesn't betray the Constitution and the People of the USA.

 

Penalty for treason:---   Under U.S. Code Title 18, the penalty is death, or not less than five years' imprisonment.   Any person convicted of treason against the United States also forfeits the right to hold public office in the United States.

Even though I would love to see Trump put behind bars one day I would be ok with just not being able to ever hold office again, we all need to be realistic and know he's never going to be held fully accountable like he should.

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1 hour ago, fourputt said:

Even though I would love to see Trump put behind bars one day I would be ok with just not being able to ever hold office again, we all need to be realistic and know he's never going to be held fully accountable like he should.

 

I actually feel it would probably be better for the country if he didn't serve time.   The important thing is to keep his pink little hands off the levers of power until age catches up with him.

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1 hour ago, bludog said:

 

I actually feel it would probably be better for the country if he didn't serve time.   The important thing is to keep his pink little hands off the levers of power until age catches up with him.

 

 

He needs to be the political, and social, pariah equal with Nixon.

 

 

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