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TheOldBarn

Some Conservative Writer named George Will

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Some conservative political commentator who has written for the Washington Post, since 1974.

He was on Fox News as a commentator for several years until one day he quit because of Trump.

Now he comes on MSNBC, as a guest commentator. 

But he stays the same. He's never changed.

To me that's okay, he should state what he believes, 

but he never talks about the divide in this country much.

He never talks about what party helped to contrive the divide, not ever.

He likes baseball, he talks about three strikes, the game is about great pitchers, 

and how they can rattle any hitter. 

If you got two strikes against you because of tax cuts for the rich 

that never grew the middle class, you are still in the batters box,

waiting for another pitch. 

The batter hits a high major league pop up and the catcher misses it because

it is just near the edge of all the people sitting their with front row seats, and because

of the sun in his eyes, he somehow fails to make the catch.

It's another foul ball, and its a three two pitch.

The odds are there are going to be a couple more foul balls, and then,

either a walk, or a hit. 

What about Obama's last pick for the supreme court?

What about that George Will?

 

What about the divide in this country and all the people who helped sew it?

 

George you're a good writer, but what do you know about economics?

 

Talk to the people George about climate changed caused by humans dependents on fossil fuel.

Talk about all the people who don't have healthcare, or about the problems with illegal immigration. 

 

Who made up the lie about open borders George? 

Who made up the lies about the ACA George?

 

You left Fox because you find Trump unconscionable, that a news source would support a president who was inept, what about

the party that still supports him. 

 

Why did they do that when you still supported them long ago, what the hell did you ever really truly stand for?

I don't think you know too much about baseball either. I guess.

Oh come on George...You never were an athlete, son.

 

Peace!

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7 hours ago, TheOldBarn said:

What about Obama's last pick for the supreme court?

What about that George Will?

 

I looked it up with that newfangled Googly-thingie:

 

Even George Will Thinks The GOP’s Wall of Opposition To Merrick Garland Is Nuts

https://thinkprogress.org/even-george-will-thinks-the-gops-wall-of-opposition-to-merrick-garland-is-nuts-25b2e18d5739/

 

 

7 hours ago, TheOldBarn said:

Who made up the lie about open borders George? 

 

Conservatives think that George Will wants open borders. He does want more immigration.

 

George Will Wants Open Borders? 'I'm For As Much Immigration As The Economy Can Take'

https://pjmedia.com/trending/george-will-demands-open-borders-im-for-as-much-immigration-as-the-economy-can-take/

 

 

7 hours ago, TheOldBarn said:

You left Fox because you find Trump unconscionable, that a news source would support a president who was inept, what about

the party that still supports him. 

 

George Will left the Republican Party because of its adherence to Trump.

 

George Will leaves the GOP

https://www.politico.com/story/2016/06/george-will-leaves-gop-224801

 

 

Here's what's important in all this:

George Will's enemy is my enemy: anti-intellectualism, anti-science, rule by thuggery.

George Will is an intelligent and intellectual conservative; and I usually disagree with him.  But he follows the rules of discourse. He understands a contradiction and he he knows when something is a shameful lie. You can talk to a person like that, and maybe convince them of half of what you believe, maybe 25% of the time.

 

Every country needs at least two intelligent sides. When intelligence is lost in public debate, you have thuggery. Upon that, both George Will and I agree.

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On 7/8/2019 at 9:55 AM, laripu said:

 

 

 

Here's what's important in all this:

George Will's enemy is my enemy: anti-intellectualism, anti-science, rule by thuggery.

George Will is an intelligent and intellectual conservative; and I usually disagree with him.  But he follows the rules of discourse. He understands a contradiction and he he knows when something is a shameful lie. You can talk to a person like that, and maybe convince them of half of what you believe, maybe 25% of the time.

 

Every country needs at least two intelligent sides. When intelligence is lost in public debate, you have thuggery. Upon that, both George Will and I agree.

True, George Will is intelligent. But until Trump was elected he did say much about a lot of the other trashy things the Republicans have done in the last thirty years.

Look, I didn't like it when Russia meddled in our presidential election. But they just augmented what the Republican Party has been doing for years. 

But sure, we do need people to talk intelligently no matter what ideology they adhere to. Talk intelligently and adhere to the facts. We need that big time.

 

Peace!

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So like I said, I don't agree with George Will on much. But here is what he wrote on Trump. Take it as 'even George f***in' Will'.

 

"I believe that what this president has done to our culture, to our civic discourse ... you cannot unring these bells and you cannot unsay what he has said, and you cannot change that he has now in a very short time made it seem normal for schoolboy taunts and obvious lies to be spun out in a constant stream. I think this will do more lasting damage than Richard Nixon's surreptitious burglaries did."

 

From:

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/07/15/politics/donald-trump-george-will-presidency/

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On 7/15/2019 at 6:55 PM, laripu said:

So like I said, I don't agree with George Will on much. But here is what he wrote on Trump. Take it as 'even George f***in' Will'.

 

"I believe that what this president has done to our culture, to our civic discourse ... you cannot unring these bells and you cannot unsay what he has said, and you cannot change that he has now in a very short time made it seem normal for schoolboy taunts and obvious lies to be spun out in a constant stream. I think this will do more lasting damage than Richard Nixon's surreptitious burglaries did."

 

From:

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/07/15/politics/donald-trump-george-will-presidency/

That's fine and dandy. Will has a wonderful vocabulary. He's been dead wrong on much of what he's said over the years, his whole premise, but you and I both agree with what he says about Trump.

Look, I like intelligent discussion. We didn't see much of that when Will was with Fox news. We still don't see it much when he comes on MSNBC. The is no discussion still, only Wills opinion. 

No, I'm not being hypercritical of George Will. I'm sixty, I've been around for a while at least. Have you ever read any Pat Buchanan pieces in the NY times? He make some good points here and there, and to be sure, he is a terrific writer. But he's way wrong on a lot of stuff I'm sure we both disagree about.

 

It would be great to have a real argument with either one. But somehow that just never happens. If I hear you correctly, you're saying there should be more of a dialogue. 

 

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20 hours ago, TheOldBarn said:

If I hear you correctly, you're saying there should be more of a dialogue. 

 

Actually, that's not what I'm saying.

 

I think George Will said it better than I could, but I'll try:

 

We have had, in the past, norms that indicated what we could say or do. They were honored even when broken. For example, the bad stuff that Nixon did; he at least knew breaking in to the DNC offices was unacceptable, and therefore tried to hide it. He was a racist, but tried to hide it. He knew what the norms were, and paid lip service to the norms.

 

So you can deal with conservatives that adhere to the norms, when they're at least giving lip service to them. If they're shown as hypocrites, your can say so and it means something.

 

Trump is different. He's changed the norms. He says they don't matter. His supporters don't care if he lies. The norms are jettisoned. He says that whatever he does is presidential by definition because he's the president. (And I hear echoes of "l'état c'est moi".) You can't reason with someone to whom reason doesn't matter, and facts don't matter. (Which is why it's useless for me to be in No Holds Barred.) He doesn't care whether something should not be done, because the only thing he cares about is what he wants to do. There are no more norms, there is only the will of the dictator.

 

George Will is saying that culture matters, and if our culture is defined by Trumpism, then we've lost an important element of Western Civilization. He's also saying that Trump has hurt conservatism, which is true. George Will's conservatism was merely wrong. Trump's brand is so far off the mark that it doesn't even rise to the level of being wrong.

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On 7/28/2019 at 4:37 PM, laripu said:

 

Actually, that's not what I'm saying.

 

I think George Will said it better than I could, but I'll try:

 

We have had, in the past, norms that indicated what we could say or do. They were honored even when broken. For example, the bad stuff that Nixon did; he at least knew breaking in to the DNC offices was unacceptable, and therefore tried to hide it. He was a racist, but tried to hide it. He knew what the norms were, and paid lip service to the norms.

 

So you can deal with conservatives that adhere to the norms, when they're at least giving lip service to them. If they're shown as hypocrites, your can say so and it means something.

 

Trump is different. He's changed the norms. He says they don't matter. His supporters don't care if he lies. The norms are jettisoned. He says that whatever he does is presidential by definition because he's the president. (And I hear echoes of "l'état c'est moi".) You can't reason with someone to whom reason doesn't matter, and facts don't matter. (Which is why it's useless for me to be in No Holds Barred.) He doesn't care whether something should not be done, because the only thing he cares about is what he wants to do. There are no more norms, there is only the will of the dictator.

 

George Will is saying that culture matters, and if our culture is defined by Trumpism, then we've lost an important element of Western Civilization. He's also saying that Trump has hurt conservatism, which is true. George Will's conservatism was merely wrong. Trump's brand is so far off the mark that it doesn't even rise to the level of being wrong.

Sure, you could just as easily have said that without quoting George Will Laripu.

 

Do you need reassurance from George Will? 

I sure as heck don't!

Peace!

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5 hours ago, TheOldBarn said:

Sure, you could just as easily have said that without quoting George Will Laripu.

 

Do you need reassurance from George Will? 

I sure as heck don't!

Peace!

 

Well he's a professional writer and I'm not. I don't need reassurance from him, but every day I get some satisfaction when I hear about prominent conservatives abandoning Trump, and then criticising him publicly.

 

Because:  If you know conservatives (and I do), this kind of thing is a way to influence them.  "See, even big honcho famous conservatives think Trump is dangerous. You should vote Democrat next time, to save the country."

 

The more that happens, the more likely it will be that he'll be defeated in the next election.

 

That is, if Putin allows it, of course. 🙄

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On 8/3/2019 at 7:14 AM, laripu said:

 

Well he's a professional writer and I'm not. I don't need reassurance from him, but every day I get some satisfaction when I hear about prominent conservatives abandoning Trump, and then criticising him publicly.

 

Because:  If you know conservatives (and I do), this kind of thing is a way to influence them.  "See, even big honcho famous conservatives think Trump is dangerous. You should vote Democrat next time, to save the country."

 

The more that happens, the more likely it will be that he'll be defeated in the next election.

 

That is, if Putin allows it, of course. 🙄

Well, he's a professional writer. He's a good writer, has a good vocabulary - always tries to keep it on message too.

Like some of the Federalist, they grow dismayed with bureaucrats because as they say, those bureaucrats were never elected by the people. And yet, we didn't write the constitution neither. 

What we have is a Congress that is supposed to be full fledged and operated by representatives duly elected by the people who are elected to perform Congressional Oversight!

Antonin Scalia was absolutely wrong about the Second Amendment  - I think it is an absurdist approach to discount the fact of history and treat the US Constitution like the Christian or Jewish  bible or the Koran - I guess they backed the indigenous people while trying to mess with the newly formulated republic - I guess the world was a bit different back then!

Peace!

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