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On another forum, I addressed (with arguments, not numbers this time) the Republican lie about trickle-down causing growth


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(Said to someone who was insisting the only way to reduce our debt is the tax cuts for the rich to increase growth): I'm going to try to help you a little with the ignorance. Let's see if you have ears.

1. Growth is not the 'only way to attack the deficit', but you're not entirely wrong - it's key to attacking the deficit. The mistake you make here is falling for the big lie that the way to increase growth is to redistribute EVEN MORE wealth to the rich. The opposite is the case. Excessive concentration of wealth HURTS the economy and HURTS growth in all kinds of ways in addition to its simple immorality and its incompatibility with democracy.

The money is idle when overly concentrated. It swells the pocketbooks of the wealthy and drives up the prices of the things they want - like companies. It drains the wealth from the engine of our economy - the consumer. Give another dollar to a billionaire and it usually does nothing to help the economy (even their mansions and private jets and yachts are only a sliver of their wealth). Give a dollar to a poor person and it's quickly SPENT, fueling the economy. Learn some basic economics.

Or hey, learn a little about economic history. Growth is almost always HIGHER under Democratic administrations and has grown MORE under the Democrats and with high tax rates, at the level where Kennedy put them. Once the Reagan ideology of trickle-down became policy all that's happened are huge deficits (with one brief interlude under Clinton's deficit-fighting budgets that initially raised taxes on the rich), and all economic growth going to the rich while Americans' incomes are flat for decades. That's it.

And that hurts growth. Every Republican prediction has been wrong. That their tax cuts would 'pay for themselves', they never have. That the economy would be destroyed under Clinton's budget - it did the opposite. That growth would explode with their cuts - it

Because it was never meant to. The real purpose has always been the obvious one: to give the rich more of your money. That's it and all the talk of jobs and growth and trickle-down and any other argument is a con job you fall for.

Another lie: after Clinton ACTUALLY balanced the budget without any Republican help after 12 years of Republicans TALKING about balancing the budget because it got votes but having record debt, Bush, the 'first MBA president', took over and promised in his first state of the union he'd not only continue the surpluses from Clinton, but that his tax cuts would pay off the debt within a decade. Of course, as always, the opposite happened and the deficit skyrocketed again.

Because that's the con. Give the American people's wealth to the rich, and say whatever con job lies about the benefits of doing it.

You have decades of history showing what these facts.

And you are too ignorant to not keep repeating the Republican propaganda lies.

Oh, by the way:

2. Other ways than growth to reduce debt include:

- Cutting the actual wasteful spending - mostly the military's bloated budget, more than all our allies combined, multiple times more than all or adversaries combined, almost as much as the other 95% of the planet combined.

- Investment by the government in growth-increasing investments in the American people. Put the stimulus into the people, not the rich and not the banks. Fund education, scientific research, infrastructure and other key programs.

Even when the government has totally WASTED its spending - building zer-value economic products like the weapons in WWII, simply employing that many people took the economy out of the Great Depression. Imagine if they built useful things.

Even when the economically useless activity of putting a man on the moon that cost up to 5% of the federal budget was done, simply the accidental results of scientific advances had enormous value (see below). Imagine if that were done for the goal of helping the country? THAT is how we get actual economic growth, NOT by simply making the rich richer so their companies are worth $100 billion instead of $25 billion.

Here are some of the benefits we just happened to get by putting a man on the moon:

1. CAT scanner: this cancer-detecting technology was first used to find imperfections in space components.
2. Computer microchip: modern microchips descend from integrated circuits used in the Apollo Guidance Computer.
3. Cordless tools: power drills and vacuum cleaners use technology designed to drill for moon samples.
4. Ear thermometer: a camera-like lens that detects infrared energy we feel as heat was originally used to monitor the birth of stars.
5. Freeze-dried food: this reduces food weight and increases shelf life without sacrificing nutritional value.
6. Insulation: home insulation uses reflective material that protects spacecraft from radiation.
7. Invisible braces: teeth-straightening is less embarrassing thanks to transparent ceramic brace brackets made from spacecraft materials.
8. Joystick: this computer gaming device was first used on the Apollo Lunar Rover.
9. Memory foam: created for aircraft seats to soften landing, this foam, which returns to its original shape, is found in mattresses and shock absorbing helmets.
10. Satellite television: technology used to fix errors in spacecraft signals helps reduce scrambled pictures and sound in satellite television signals.
11. Scratch resistant lenses: astronaut helmet visor coating makes our spectacles ten times more scratch resistant.
12. Shoe insoles: athletic shoe companies adapted space boot designs to lessen impact by adding spring and ventilation.
13. Smoke detector: Nasa invented the first adjustable smoke detector with sensitivity levels to prevent false alarms.
14. Swimsuit: Nasa used the same principles that reduce drag in space to help create the world’s fastest swimsuit for Speedo, rejected by some professionals for giving an unfair advantage.
15. Water filter: domestic versions borrow a technique Nasa pioneered to kill bacteria in water taken into space.

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