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A Well Regulated Militia...


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1 minute ago, Golfboy said:

From the woman that thinks Jefferson wanted to ban his own guns. 

 

I never said this.  This is 100% lie from a guy who can't win by being 

truthful.  Are you Moscow Mitch McConnell or Lindsay Graham.....

I think you are a LOT like GRAHAM, eh?  

 

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What is a gun nutter? And yes, the constitution says we may arm ourselves with whatever firearm we want .  Would you like to rewrite the constitution? To bend it to fit YOUR feelings ?  fuck your

sad Scout doesn't understand the 2nd Amendment... the bitch doesn't realize that without the 2nd you don't have the 1st.

Yes, they did.  

2 minutes ago, Scout said:

 

I never said this.  This is 100% lie from a guy who can't win by being 

truthful.  Are you Moscow Mitch McConnell or Lindsay Graham.....

I think you are a LOT like GRAHAM, eh?  

 

@Golfboy - Hey, just say "thanks" - that's quite a complement!

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5 minutes ago, Scout said:

 

I never said this.  This is 100% lie from a guy who can't win by being 

truthful.  Are you Moscow Mitch McConnell or Lindsay Graham.....

I think you are a LOT like GRAHAM, eh?  

 

You've repeatedly said the founders supported gun control. 

That's simply not true. 

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2 minutes ago, Golfboy said:

You've repeatedly said the founders supported gun control. 

That's simply not true. 

 

That isn't what you claimed I said.

You changed it on purpose because the truth doesn't work for you.

 

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Just now, Scout said:

That isn't what you claimed I said.

You changed it on purpose because the truth doesn't work for you.

It is what you said.  They never banned guns, or even proposed the idea. 

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1 minute ago, Scout said:

Yes, they did.

Nope.  And it doesn't matter how many times you repeat that lie, it's not going to magically come true. 

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The founders were not rightwingers.

They were not people who sit around fantasizing about murdering people.

They were people who wanted to create a safe world, not a violent one.

They were NOT EVER rightwingers EXCEPT the ones

that owned slaves.  

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1 minute ago, Golfboy said:

Nope.  And it doesn't matter how many times you repeat that lie, it's not going to magically come true. 

Yes, they did.  And it doesn't matter how often you deny it, we KNOW

for a FACT that the Founders had their own gun control laws

and that gun nutters are liars with sexual dysfunction tied to

their guns. 

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Just now, Scout said:

The founders were not rightwingers.

They were not people who sit around fantasizing about murdering people.

They were people who wanted to create a safe world, not a violent one.

They were NOT EVER rightwingers EXCEPT the ones

that owned slaves.  

oh look, a temper tantrum.  Crazy Smileys

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Just now, Scout said:

Yes, they did.  And it doesn't matter how often you deny it, we KNOW

for a FACT that the Founders had their own gun control laws

and that gun nutters are liars with sexual dysfunction tied to

their guns. 

Repetition of your lie isn't going to magically make it come true. 

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2 hours ago, Scout said:

I didn't know he was going to do that and I doubt you do either.

But he has my full support.

People who carry AR15s are trash like you.

 

No one knows what he’s going to do next . Not even him . 

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1 hour ago, Scout said:

The founders were not rightwingers.

They were not people who sit around fantasizing about murdering people.

They were people who wanted to create a safe world, not a violent one.

They were NOT EVER rightwingers EXCEPT the ones

that owned slaves.  

they must have been leftist because they turned into Demonrats and KKK.

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The larger problem with a market-driven theory of gun policy is that it is the opposite of the Founders’ intent as well as the plain meaning of the text. The Second Amendment was not designed to hobble government regulation. At the time, men arrived for military service already armed with guns the government required them to purchase. Contrary to Thomas and Scalia, the law did not countenance Americans simply showing up with whatever weapons they owned—that is, what was in common use. Without specific regulations and instead following common use or preference, most Americans would likely have shown up for active duty with fowling pieces, which were more like shot guns than muskets, because these were better suited for putting food on the table. In other words, the Founders recognized that if left to the free market and people’s own preferences, America’s militias would be prepared to hunt turkeys, not fight a powerful European standing army. A reliance on the market could have cost America its freedom. The various militia regulations enacted by states in the colonial period and after the adoption of the Second Amendment specified what weapons were required to meet the legal obligation of citizens to serve in the militia. Failing to report to the militia properly armed with the right weapon could result in fines. If the Founders had understood the Second Amendment in the way Scalia and Thomas suggest, the United States would likely have lost the American Revolution.

 

-- Saul Cornell 

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In the decades after the adoption of the Second Amendment, gun regulations only became more stringent. As guns became cheaper and more reliable, they posed an ever-greater threat to public safety. In response, the first modern-style gun-control laws were passed. To be sure, some of these laws were challenged in court, and some courts, particularly those in the slave-holding South, struck them down. In his Heller opinion, Scalia ignored the history of cases upholding new gun regulations—that is, the vast majority of cases—and focused instead on the few slave-state cases that struck them down.

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Fortunately, it appears that the current majority of justices do not accept that the Scalia-Thomas common-use theory is central to the Heller holding. Instead, most courts and scholars have read Heller as limiting the right to own a gun to self-defense and have noted that this right is greatest in the home. The state, Heller acknowledges, has a much greater interest in limiting the proliferation of guns in public squares and thoroughfares. In England, such restrictions date back to the 14th century; they were then transplanted into U.S. law in many states by the Founding generation. The history of the Second Amendment does not supplant the government with the market; it supports a robust public power to regulate guns for reasons of public safety.

The good news is that those on the Court who see any attempt to regulate guns as unconstitutional are a small and isolated minority. 

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1 minute ago, Scout said:

The history of the Second Amendment does not supplant the government with the market; it supports a robust public power to regulate guns for reasons of public safety.

There is nothing in the 2nd amendment that allows gun regulations. 

What did the founding Fathers think about gun control?  They never mention it except to oppose disarming Americans.

 

“And that the said Constitution be never construed to authorize Congress to infringe the just liberty of the Press, or the rights of Conscience; or to prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms.” – Samuel Adams.

 

“Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the American people’s liberty teeth and keystone under independence.” – George Washington

 

“Are we at last brought to such humiliating and debasing degradation, that we cannot be trusted with arms for our defense? Where is the difference between having our arms in possession and under our direction and having them under the management of Congress? If our defense be the real object of having those arms, in whose hands can they be trusted with more propriety, or equal safety to us, as in our own hands?” – Patrick Henry.

 

“The best we can hope for concerning the people at large is that they be properly armed.” – Alexander Hamilton.

 

“To disarm the people is the most effectual way to enslave them.” – George Mason.

 

“Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed, as they are in almost every country in Europe.” – Noah Webster.

 

“Americans have the right and advantage of being armed, unlike the people of other countries, whose leaders are afraid to trust them with arms.” – James Madison.

 

“Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.” – Benjamin Franklin.

 

“A free people ought to be armed.” – George Washington.

 

“No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms.” – Thomas Jefferson.

 

“The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere restrains evil interference – they deserve a place of honor with all that’s good.” – George Washington.

 

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10 hours ago, Scout said:

No, but according to gun nutters, they should have the freedom to 

arm themselves with anything the military uses.

 

So, what is your point?  

My point is that 2A uses the phrases "the right of the people" and "shall not be infringed" .  you have gotten hung up on the word militia. . I want to know who you believe "the people" are and what does it mean to you "shall not be infringed".  Pretend , for the sake of this discussion that , shall not be infringed were to be applied to abortion. What is an infringement, and what infringements would you accept.

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4 minutes ago, shetluck said:

My point is that 2A uses the phrases "the right of the people" and "shall not be infringed" .  you have gotten hung up on the word militia. . I want to know who you believe "the people" are and what does it mean to you "shall not be infringed".  Pretend , for the sake of this discussion that , shall not be infringed were to be applied to abortion. What is an infringement, and what infringements would you accept.

I believe what the Founders themselves did to be the intended meaning.....

they had gun control and we have gun control.  

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4 hours ago, Scout said:

 In England, such restrictions date back to the 14th century

The Irish were unarmed. That certainly did them a world of good. 

Queen Elizabeth I and her genocide policy: if she had lived in the 20th Century. she would have been viewed with the same horror as Hitler and Stalin.

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Just now, Scout said:

I believe what the Founders themselves did to be the intended meaning.....

they had gun control and we have gun control.  

sad Scout doesn't understand the 2nd Amendment... the bitch doesn't realize that without the 2nd you don't have the 1st.

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1 minute ago, Scout said:

I believe what the Founders themselves did to be the intended meaning.....

they had gun control and we have gun control.  

The Founders did NOT impose gun control.  You're a liar. 

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1 minute ago, Scout said:

I believe what the Founders themselves did to be the intended meaning.....

they had gun control and we have gun control.  

The founders used shall not be infringed. Other than cannons, I am unaware of restrictions on arms, hence the "shall not be infringed"

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