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1 hour ago, jrobin15283 said:

If you want my 100% HONEST opinion, I believe that abortion is murder, because that is the most logically consistent way to see the value of human life.  If you try to rationalize why human life is worth less than anyone else's, you can get to a very dangerous level in society, where people are valued based upon certain characteristics.  Things did not end well when this happened historically, most notably during the slavery era and the holocaust.  If you believe that murder is wrong, I don't see why you wouldnt believe that abortion is wrong.

 

FYI, eggs aren't "aborted chickens", because they are not fertilized.

You need to check the grocery aisle more carefully. Fertilized chicken eggs are available, right there in the egg aisle.

Human beings think human lives have "special value" because of species bias and religious psychobabble indoctrination.

Every hen thinks she has laid the best egg. If we decided to interview a next of cockroaches, they would assert that THEY are the most-important species, and created by a Superbeing, and destined to eventually reign supreme over all other sentient beings.

Why are human lives more valuable than other lives? Only because human beings keep telling themselves this. The TRUTH is....homo sapiens isn't even particularly viable worm food, and the planet and the rest of the ecosystem would fare far better without the presence of the hairless ape. 

Human beings serve ONLY the needs of themselves. 

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2 hours ago, jrobin15283 said:

Wanting abortion to be unavailable DOES NOT MEAN that I believe that someone has greater rights than anyone else.  If you fail to understand that, there is not much that I can do for you.

 

Yes, it does.  It means that you think a brainless blob of cells trumps the healthcare rights of a woman.

There is not debating this --- that is the kind of rotten American you are.

 

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1 hour ago, jrobin15283 said:

If you want my 100% HONEST opinion, I believe that abortion is murder, because that is the most logically consistent way to see the value of human life.  If you try to rationalize why human life is worth less than anyone else's, you can get to a very dangerous level in society, where people are valued based upon certain characteristics.  Things did not end well when this happened historically, most notably during the slavery era and the holocaust.  If you believe that murder is wrong, I don't see why you wouldnt believe that abortion is wrong.

 

FYI, eggs aren't "aborted chickens", because they are not fertilized.

Yes, they often are fertilized.

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20 hours ago, Fit2Serve said:

You need to check the grocery aisle more carefully. Fertilized chicken eggs are available, right there in the egg aisle.

Human beings think human lives have "special value" because of species bias and religious psychobabble indoctrination.

Every hen thinks she has laid the best egg. If we decided to interview a next of cockroaches, they would assert that THEY are the most-important species, and created by a Superbeing, and destined to eventually reign supreme over all other sentient beings.

Why are human lives more valuable than other lives? Only because human beings keep telling themselves this. The TRUTH is....homo sapiens isn't even particularly viable worm food, and the planet and the rest of the ecosystem would fare far better without the presence of the hairless ape. 

Human beings serve ONLY the needs of themselves. 

So do you believe that murder is okay?

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On 9/27/2019 at 11:11 AM, Fit2Serve said:

You need to check the grocery aisle more carefully. Fertilized chicken eggs are available, right there in the egg aisle.

Human beings think human lives have "special value" because of species bias and religious psychobabble indoctrination.

Every hen thinks she has laid the best egg. If we decided to interview a next of cockroaches, they would assert that THEY are the most-important species, and created by a Superbeing, and destined to eventually reign supreme over all other sentient beings.

Why are human lives more valuable than other lives? Only because human beings keep telling themselves this. The TRUTH is....homo sapiens isn't even particularly viable worm food, and the planet and the rest of the ecosystem would fare far better without the presence of the hairless ape. 

Human beings serve ONLY the needs of themselves. 

Well....?

Do you believe murder is okay?

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not according to the bible in the bible its considered a civil property violation and remember up till the 1870s abortion was legal and accepted in american culture that changed because of medical advancement not morality per se

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brief section of case law.

Exodus 21:22-25 describes a case where a pregnant woman jumps into a fight between her husband and another man and suffers injuries that cause her to miscarry. Injuries to the woman prompt the normal penalties for harming another human being: an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, a life for a life. Killing the woman is murder, a capital crime.

The miscarriage is treated differently, however — as property loss, not murder. The assailant must pay a fine to the husband. The law of a life for a life does not apply. The fetus is important, but it’s not human life in the same way the pregnant woman is.

My impression is that most Americans have a more nuanced and conservative view than the Bible does on this, though we’re getting at the same idea: an important moral and legal line is crossed when the fetus can survive outside the womb.

For the Bible, that’s when a child is born and starts breathing. For many of us today, it’s when a fetus becomes “viable” — somewhere between 21 and 27 weeks into the pregnancy, thanks to our amazing medical technology.

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On September 27, 2019 at 12:11 PM, Fit2Serve said:

You need to check the grocery aisle more carefully. Fertilized chicken eggs are available, right there in the egg aisle.

Human beings think human lives have "special value" because of species bias and religious psychobabble indoctrination.

Every hen thinks she has laid the best egg. If we decided to interview a next of cockroaches, they would assert that THEY are the most-important species, and created by a Superbeing, and destined to eventually reign supreme over all other sentient beings.

Why are human lives more valuable than other lives? Only because human beings keep telling themselves this. The TRUTH is....homo sapiens isn't even particularly viable worm food, and the planet and the rest of the ecosystem would fare far better without the presence of the hairless ape. 

Human beings serve ONLY the needs of themselves. 

 

You make a great argument for relieving the planet of your presence.

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10 hours ago, guilluamezenz said:

not according to the bible in the bible its considered a civil property violation and remember up till the 1870s abortion was legal and accepted in american culture that changed because of medical advancement not morality per se

Notice how youre the only person bringing up the bible.  The bible doesnt help your argument.

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10 hours ago, guilluamezenz said:

brief section of case law.

Exodus 21:22-25 describes a case where a pregnant woman jumps into a fight between her husband and another man and suffers injuries that cause her to miscarry. Injuries to the woman prompt the normal penalties for harming another human being: an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, a life for a life. Killing the woman is murder, a capital crime.

The miscarriage is treated differently, however — as property loss, not murder. The assailant must pay a fine to the husband. The law of a life for a life does not apply. The fetus is important, but it’s not human life in the same way the pregnant woman is.

My impression is that most Americans have a more nuanced and conservative view than the Bible does on this, though we’re getting at the same idea: an important moral and legal line is crossed when the fetus can survive outside the womb.

For the Bible, that’s when a child is born and starts breathing. For many of us today, it’s when a fetus becomes “viable” — somewhere between 21 and 27 weeks into the pregnancy, thanks to our amazing medical technology.

WHAT???? That verse says nothing of the sort!!!!  It specifically says to pay a fine"if no mischief follows" (KJV), meaning that there was NO SERIOUS DAMAGE DONE.  whatever the case, your little Bible verse MOST DEFINITELY Does not help your argument.  In fact, in the next verse, it says "life for a life" if mischief follows.  Now, there can be room for interpretation here, but ONE THING IS FOR CERTAIN: the Bible NEVER stated that the fetus was not a human being or a lesser human being.  PLEASE ELABORATE.!

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On 9/27/2019 at 11:11 AM, Fit2Serve said:

You need to check the grocery aisle more carefully. Fertilized chicken eggs are available, right there in the egg aisle.

Human beings think human lives have "special value" because of species bias and religious psychobabble indoctrination.

Every hen thinks she has laid the best egg. If we decided to interview a next of cockroaches, they would assert that THEY are the most-important species, and created by a Superbeing, and destined to eventually reign supreme over all other sentient beings.

Why are human lives more valuable than other lives? Only because human beings keep telling themselves this. The TRUTH is....homo sapiens isn't even particularly viable worm food, and the planet and the rest of the ecosystem would fare far better without the presence of the hairless ape. 

Human beings serve ONLY the needs of themselves. 

You must believe murder is okay, then

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On 9/27/2019 at 11:50 AM, Scout said:

 

Yes, it does.  It means that you think a brainless blob of cells trumps the healthcare rights of a woman.

There is not debating this --- that is the kind of rotten American you are.

 

No, i believe that they have an equal right to live.

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2 minutes ago, jrobin15283 said:

No, i believe that they have an equal right to live.

 

Well, there is nothing rational about claiming a brainless blob of cells has equal rights.

 

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JROBIN there is no "equal right to live" for brainless blobs of cells in the Dec. of Indep. or the Constitution.

Try again.

 

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15 hours ago, jrobin15283 said:

Well....?

Do you believe murder is okay?

If you buy into this line of reasoning, we can arrest farmers for sending pigs to slaughter.

 

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11 minutes ago, Scout said:

JROBIN there is no "equal right to live" for brainless blobs of cells in the Dec. of Indep. or the Constitution.

Try again.

 

Let me rephrase: they have a right not to be killed and should be granted the human rights as listed in the UN

 

And yes, Life is included as a virtue in the declaration of independence.  LIFE, liberty, and the persuit of happiness.

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1 minute ago, jrobin15283 said:

Let me rephrase: they have a right not to be killed and should be granted the human rights as listed in the UN

 

And yes, Life is included as a virtue in the declaration of independence.  LIFE, liberty, and the persuit of happiness.

 

So you beieve the Dec. of Indep. applies to deer and cats and pigs, etc.

 

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Just now, Scout said:

 

So you beieve the Dec. of Indep. applies to deer and cats and pigs, etc.

 

no, where did you draw that conclusion?  

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I assume JRobin's attempt to control other people rights and lives also applies to removing

life support to those who are brain dead, etc.

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1 hour ago, Scout said:

I assume JRobin's attempt to control other people rights and lives also applies to removing

life support to those who are brain dead, etc.

No it doesnt.  Again, how did you draw that conclusion?

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2 hours ago, Scout said:

If you buy into this line of reasoning, we can arrest farmers for sending pigs to slaughter.

 

There is no connection between abortion and livestock farming

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8 minutes ago, jrobin15283 said:

There is no connection between abortion and livestock farming

 

A pig has more value than a blob of cells with no brain.

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You are the one that claims life is protect by the D of I.  The D of I doesn't say what form of life and it certainly never claims it applies to fetuses with no brain.

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