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Do they have student loans in Germany?


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How about non union automakers?

This is a good post. You posted a thought provoking question. It is clear that you have an opinion in this matter but you are not attacking, and not being juvenile. You are inviting people to research on their own and come to a conclusion and then come back and share.

 

I, for one, think we need more balance in everything. There are two legitimate sides to every issue. Then there is the rare, mature adult that recognizes and respects both arguments, makes a decision based upon their unique principles and past experiences, but invites dissent acknowledging that we all have different principles and past experiences.

 

Please try to me more of the latter more often. It really makes me respect you more.

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Basically here's what I see right now, because German automakers sell high quality premium cars to rich people they are able to offer more of that profit back. This has enabled smooth relations with their unions.

 

US automakers have not traditionally sold quality and cater to a lower income clientele. Since they need to keep price low to sell the cars, they need to keep cost of goods sold. US unions have not always acknowledged that simple economic reality and have generally engaged management poorly. Management in reaction has hunkered into a cornered and dealt with labor from and adversarial place instead of a cooperative place. I think both can take the time to understand the other side more...especially labor demanding concessions that if there wasn't government intervention would have led to bankruptcy and a loss of many jobs. They need to acknowledge limits so that management can stay in business. Management can acknowledge their feelings more and explain better the consequences of any demands. In the US, it basically like this site, not understanding and respecting the other side - we attack. Then hunkered in our corners we defend ourselves and counter attack.

 

Germans are practical. They are better able to rationally reach a bottom line without emotions clouding their views.

 

A counterargument might be - why do German automakers pay their US workers less?

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Does Germany have student loans? Yes, there is a federal backed student loan available to those from lower income families. It is repaid once earnings cross a certain threshold. A fairly standard student loan. It is normal that any students getting the loan also get a grant of equal amount.

 

Does Germany have unionisation in Auto-makers? Yes the main industrial union IG Metall certainly covers them. Plus of course many of the things American unions are fighting for (paid leave etc.) are legally required in Germany.

 

Of course not everybody joins the union but 100% unionisation is pretty rare in any industry.

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How about non union automakers?

 

Does Germany permit non-citizens to receive benefits, and does German law make any individual born on German soil a German citizen?

 

Our government could do a whole lot for us, but as long as we have birthright citizenship tax paying American citizens will continue to be cheated by those who come here looking to take advantage of our system.

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The majority of non citizens resident in Germany get full benefits equal to that of a German citizen and even have voting rights in many elections. Some form of benefits for people working and paying taxes in a country seems reasonable. If your argument is that non citizens should have no money spent on them, in the event of a draft (the USA can draft resident non citizens) would you oppose them being paid? Or more likely things do non citizens deserve same rights in the criminal justice system?

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The majority of non citizens resident in Germany get full benefits equal to that of a German citizen and even have voting rights in many elections. Some form of benefits for people working and paying taxes in a country seems reasonable. If your argument is that non citizens should have no money spent on them, in the event of a draft (the USA can draft resident non citizens) would you oppose them being paid? Or more likely things do non citizens deserve same rights in the criminal justice system?

 

Any Federal benefit that isn't earned, so non-citizens are still entitled to Medicare and Social Security, but not Pell Grants for attending college.

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So how do you earn the right to a fair trial? Or what exactly is considered a benefit, a right and something that needs to be earned.

 

Anyway that is about the same as Germany, so any relevance is limited (plus of course German degree level education is generally free, or at most ~$1,000 per year and non citizen residents can take advantage of it (with some limits but not large ones)).

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The majority of non citizens resident in Germany get full benefits equal to that of a German citizen and even have voting rights in many elections. Some form of benefits for people working and paying taxes in a country seems reasonable. If your argument is that non citizens should have no money spent on them, in the event of a draft (the USA can draft resident non citizens) would you oppose them being paid? Or more likely things do non citizens deserve same rights in the criminal justice system?

 

The krauts do not take kindly to anyone illegally in their country. You can be in a resident and not be in the citizen, and like here in the US you're entitled to government benefits. I worked in Europe for six months. You also didn't answer his question. Does being born in Germany make you a German citizen automatically.

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He asked two questions, I answered one. Of course Germany doesn't allow automatic citizenship to anyone born in Germany (that is extremely rare) but anyone born to a legal resident in Germany (and who is resident for 8 years) gets German citizenship. That said German citizenship is easier to get that American citizenship.

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He asked two questions, I answered one. Of course Germany doesn't allow automatic citizenship to anyone born in Germany (that is extremely rare) but anyone born to a legal resident in Germany (and who is resident for 8 years) gets German citizenship. That said German citizenship is easier to get that American citizenship.

 

You're insane. The US naturalizes more new citizens than all of Europe combined, and a larger percentage of it's population is foreign born. So clearly it's not easier to get German citizenship. Of course Germany doesn't allow automatic citizenship to anyone born in Germany, but the US does, and that was his point. You want to idealize a country, take the good with the bad.

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I thought Germany provided an education to all its citizens, then put them to work in its factories and businesses.

 

Nope, just to the ones who qualify. You should try getting out of the house every now and then. Seeing Germany would do you a lot of good.

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This is a good post. You posted a thought provoking question. It is clear that you have an opinion in this matter but you are not attacking, and not being juvenile. You are inviting people to research on their own and come to a conclusion and then come back and share.

 

This is a very urbane and good-natured reply to Warf Rat2's five-word OP. You set a standard for us all to live by, MassLiberty.

 

Sincerely,

jayjay

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He asked two questions, I answered one. Of course Germany doesn't allow automatic citizenship to anyone born in Germany (that is extremely rare) but anyone born to a legal resident in Germany (and who is resident for 8 years) gets German citizenship. That said German citizenship is easier to get that American citizenship.

 

There's certain government services that exist for the common good(such as your stated example of a fair trial), which we all pay for, and then all the little extras we've voted in for ourselves over the course of the past century or so. Anything that is not an essential government service, or is not paid for by the individual benefiting from the service, should be restricted solely to citizens.

 

I do have to agree that German citizenship is a tad bit easier to get than US citizenship, as all I need to do to get my German citizenship was be born. The US expected me to be born here and learn how to speak English.

 

I thought Germany provided an education to all its citizens, then put them to work in its factories and businesses.

 

Unfortunately there's not many Americans willing to work in factories.

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So if the US returns the draft, non citizen residents (that can be called up) would be paid to fight, but could not receive say health care equivalent to whatever Us citizen veterans get?

 

I'm sure that the case could be made that the uniformed services isn't an essential function of the Federal government for the common good, but I do.

 

Think more along the lines of in-state tuition at public universities for citizens only. All those small little perks add up, and make US citizenship more valuable and thus more desirable.

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Wether you argue that uniform services isn't an essential services, it would be stupid to draft foreign nationals and then not pay them.

 

Think more along the lines of in-state tuition at public universities for citizens only. All those small little perks add up, and make US citizenship more valuable and thus more desirable.

 

This is reasonable, but do you want people to get US citizenship just for the benefits, then leave when they are done?

 

Secondly would you allow foreign nationals to apply for research grants that cover fees?

 

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This is a very urbane and good-natured reply to Warf Rat2's five-word OP. You set a standard for us all to live by, MassLiberty.

 

Sincerely,

jayjay

 

I'm honestly trying to encourage respectful disagreements and discussion.

 

Some are too far gone for hope- Shintao, skews and skeptic come to mind. But others seem to be able to be adults. The jury is out on wharf.

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My point is Germany isn't nurturing an entire society filled with minimum wage employees trying to pay off student loans for degrees aimed at jobs they'll never have.

 

Isn't it a bit fuhked up for banks to finance a product marketed by colleges for jobs that don't exist?



My point is Germany isn't nurturing an entire society filled with minimum wage employees trying to pay off student loans for degrees aimed at jobs they'll never have.

 

Isn't it a bit fuhked up for banks to finance a product marketed by colleges for jobs that don't exist?



I'm honestly trying to encourage respectful disagreements and discussion.

Some are too far gone for hope- Shintao, skews and skeptic come to mind. But others seem to be able to be adults. The jury is out on wharf.

My point is Germany isn't nurturing an entire society filled with minimum wage employees trying to pay off student loans for degrees aimed at jobs they'll never have.

 

Isn't it a bit fuhked up for banks to finance a product marketed by colleges for jobs that don't exist?

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