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Libs who still support Obama deserve neither liberty nor security

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Sorry,12 hour day yesterday, the sarcasm went right over my head.

 

All good.

 

Like most, including those that think closer to me than you in Congress, we went along with Bush with relevant

caution. In the end he got what he lead us to time and time again.

 

We certainly didn't go in with the idea of making Bush/our country fail, so he did that largely on his own. We

joined the nationalism, the go shopping crowd, bought"American" Vehicles & put up flags like I suppose you did.

The numbers say we did that. The numbers also show that our following Bush was a huge mistake... the biggest was

that we should have been in sacrifice mode during war especially one where the opponent's intent was to bankrupt

th US ... but we weren't.

 

You were supporting the economy like the rest of us. Good on ya. How is Bush so different than Obama? They're one and the same. That's why I said wake up. Bush increased the debt 4 trillion and change in 8 years. Obama has increased the debt 7 trillion in 5. Bush got us into two wars that could have been handled with Spec Ops forces, but they weren't that robust at the time. Obama has kept one going and expanded his drone strike authority. WAKE UP! NO DIFFERENCE! One instituted the Patriot Act, the other kept it going and expanded presidential power with the NDAA. WAKE UP!! NO DIFFERENCE!!! Blind faith in our leaders is wrong, bottom line.

 

 

"Bin Laden: Goal is to bankrupt U.S."

 

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/11/01/binladen.tape/

 

We are defending Obama against a barrage of false innuendo. You are defending Bush with false claims even though the opposite truth is known.

 

"The Norwegian Nobel Committee has decided that the Nobel Peace Prize for 2009 is to be awarded to President

Barack Obama for his extraordinary efforts to strengthen international diplomacy and cooperation between

peoples."

 

He was president for a few months. What did he do besides be half black? He supported the overthrow of several legitimate, albeit unfriendly, governments. His drone attacks kill indiscriminately. Pakistan has had it with them. He's killed US citizens who we "think" were a threat to the US without due process. You can't be that stupid.

 

http://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/peace/laureates/2009/press.html

 

You guys complained he was traveling too much.

 

"Limbaugh: I Hope Obama Fails"

 

http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2009/01/16/limbaugh_i_hope_obama_fails

 

"MCCONNELL: We need to be honest with the public. This election is about them, not us. And we need to treat this

election as the first step in retaking the government. We need to say to everyone on Election Day, “Those of you

who helped make this a good day, you need to go out and help us finish the job.”

 

NATIONAL JOURNAL: What’s the job?

 

MCCONNELL: The single most important thing we want to achieve is for President Obama to be a one-term president."

 

http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2010/10/25/126242/mcconnell-obama-one-term/

 

Well no kidding. They're on the opposite end of the political spectrum. Just like the left wanted Bush to fail, they want Obama to fail. It's called politics. It's also wrong as hell for anyone to do it. Your side called Bush every name in the book and painted him as the anti-Christ. The right does the same for Obama, but holy crap, I've never seen idol worship like I do with this guy. Seriously? The president's face on a t-shirt? Where's the dignity of our highest office? WAKE UP! When you realize what I'm saying, you'll know what I mean.

 

 

No matter how strong the Hope was, your kind worked against that Change from before day one. What are you people doing, mimicking the school yard bully going, "Na-na-na-na-na"?

 

"The $75 billion goes toward reducing mortgage payments for as many as four million "at-risk" homeowners. The program is only available for owner-occupied, principal residences with mortgages that originated before Jan. 1, 2009. To qualify, the borrower's monthly mortgage payments must exceed 31 percent of their gross monthly income. In addition, they must also have undergone some type of financial hardship—such as a loss of income—that puts them at risk of default."

 

http://money.usnews.com/money/personal-finance/real-estate/articles/2009/03/06/i-pay-my-mortgage-whats-in-the-housing-bailout-for-me

 

Hardly Obama paying outright for someone's mortgage, perhaps you are confused over the TARP fund that bailed out the mortgage industry. It was Bush signed that into law because his SHTF.

 

 

Actually Clinton deregulated the banks before he left office which caused the housing bubble to burst. Glassman-Steagall Act I think. Don't quote me on the actual name. Bush got the "credit" for it. But that wasn't what I was referring to. I was referring to all those people who quit their jobs, etc. to attend the inaugaration saying Obama was going to pay their bills because they were black. It was all over the news and now it's all over Youtube. How ignorant can you be to assume that? (not you, them)

 

 

"The cell phone distribution program did begin in 2008, the year Obama was elected president, but that is a

coincidence. Let’s look more closely at the facts."

 

http://www.freegovernmentcellphones.net/faq/obama-phone

 

Really?

 

Don't even need to check the link. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you posted the actual story behind the Obamaphones. My point was that the constant idol worship of this guy is just wrong. He can lead you to a cliff like a bunch of lemmings and convince you to jump because he said it.

 

And, you want me to wake up?

 

You don't understand what I'm saying. When you do, you'll know what I mean.

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So when they, let's say, deny your 10 yr old daughter a vaccine to protect her from the next big outbreak of some highly contagious and deadly virus because they now have access to her medical records and see that she has a genetic heart abnormality, and shit, there just isn't enough of the vaccine to go around so the weak must be weeded out, you'll be okay with that?

 

Is the threat being sold to the American public sufficient to justify stripping us of doctor/patient privilege on top of every other area of privacy we have a right to, as Americans? I don't think it is. If they can't ferret out the terrorists without infringing on my basic right to privacy unnecessarily then they suck at their jobs and need to be replaced.

 

My views on privacy are not pathetic. Privacy is my right unless I choose to give it up. You are obviously unconcerned with the government having as much information about you as they want. That's fine. Let them have yours and leave mine alone.

1. Maybe in the UK they may have access to her medical records. In the USA, we have the HIPPA laws which protect medical information from being revealed. I haven't heard that this has been subverted in any way, have you ?

 

2. Problem with leaving your information (phone records ?) alone is, that might lessen the protection we all need to keep us from being slaughtered by Islamic lunatics. We live in a much more technologized age than we used to. And a much more dangerous one too. ANd we have to be able to deal with it. As they used to say in college >> form follows function. And as they used to say in the US Army >> you do what you gotta do.

 

He feels that rights are SCARY dangerous things he wants no one to have. This man has a fear driven mindset.

No more fear than Americans of 1942. Good thing they had fear, and took appropriate action based on that fear. If they hadn't, we might not be here now (or ever).

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Agreed. The same could be said about GW Bush supporters, but I bet you won't agree.

+1

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hannibal wrot: (nothing)

He cut and pasted a load of horsecrap from a rw site.

I asked for proof of a lie, not some bogus list of bogus promises. She me the quote, false flagger.

 

Quote Obama saying "i promise to..." then show how he backslid.

You can't, all u can do is whine and bit_ch. Poor baby.

He closed gitmo, he ended the iraq war, he ended the effing afghan war. He did everythi g he said he would do.

Just because you don't like the fact that he doesn't do every leetle thing you want, you cry like a little schoolgirl.

Grow up.

Get back to us when you can provide backup for anything on that stolen list. Do your own fukken work.

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hannibal wrot: (nothing)

He cut and pasted a load of horsecrap from a rw site.

I asked for proof of a lie, not some bogus list of bogus promises. She me the quote, false flagger.

Never pretend you care about the truth again, you are partisan to the bone, your last comments prove it. Here ya go you LIAR.....

 

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/rulings/promise-broken/

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1. Maybe in the UK they may have access to her medical records. In the USA, we have the HIPPA laws which protect medical information from being revealed. I haven't heard that this has been subverted in any way, have you ?

 

How much of a fuss would you put up if it was subverted? You who thinks privacy is an acceptable casualty of the war on terror? We still had habeas corpus until the Patriot Act. Detaining citizens indefinitely without charging them with a crime was unconstitutional until the Bush administration wiggled it's way around it.

 

If the government needs patient's medical records to fight their war on terror, do you really think HIPPA will stop them, if the Constitution is insufficient to stop them? Wake up.

 

2. Problem with leaving your information (phone records ?) alone is, that might lessen the protection we all need to keep us from being slaughtered by Islamic lunatics.

 

 

Like I said, if government security agencies can't catch potential terrorists without infringing on the rights of its law abiding citizens, they need to be replaced. I'd rather take my chances with Islamic lunatics than give away any more of my rights to the fucking US government - I'm an American, btw.

 

No more fear than Americans of 1942. Good thing they had fear, and took appropriate action based on that fear. If they hadn't, we might not be here now (or ever).

 

Sorry, fear is not a good thing when it results in the fear leading us to accept a loss of freedom.

 

Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.

~ Benjamin Franklin

 

So true.

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How much of a fuss would you put up if it was subverted? You who thinks privacy is an acceptable casualty of the war on terror? We still had habeas corpus until the Patriot Act. Detaining citizens indefinitely without charging them with a crime was unconstitutional until the Bush administration wiggled it's way around it.

 

If the government needs patient's medical records to fight their war on terror, do you really think HIPPA will stop them, if the Constitution is insufficient to stop them? Wake up.

 

Like I said, if government security agencies can't catch potential terrorists without infringing on the rights of its law abiding citizens, they need to be replaced. I'd rather take my chances with Islamic lunatics than give away any more of my rights to the fucking US government - I'm an American, btw.

 

Sorry, fear is not a good thing when it results in the fear leading us to accept a loss of freedom.

 

Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.

~ Benjamin Franklin

 

So true.

 

 

 

179765_472277779533395_15491212_n.jpg

 

This is why our Founders saw to it that we would be a Heavily Armed Nation, and a Force to be reckoned with..

 

That we may NEVER live in fear of Tyranny, Tyrants, or Terrorists...

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"You can't have 100 percent security and also then have 100 percent privacy and zero inconvenience. We're going to have to make some choices as a society."

~ Barack Obama.

 

Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.

~ Benjamin Franklin

Live by hypotheticals ruled by hyperbole adopted from working theories real doesn't exist in plain sight. Now what that leaves is character's rights defined by subjective laws that rule rank has its privileges when ancestors give away the liberty of their own future ancestry for legal rights now pretending to defend humanity and protect the faith of good intentions societal evolution is intellects salvation from oppressive instincts hosting the gender playing the role of a lifetime cradle to grave.

 

Time is money is mythology ruling adapt or become extinct natural balance not allowed to be totally understood where that natural balance originates within the moment here.

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How much of a fuss would you put up if it was subverted? You who thinks privacy is an acceptable casualty of the war on terror? We still had habeas corpus until the Patriot Act. Detaining citizens indefinitely without charging them with a crime was unconstitutional until the Bush administration wiggled it's way around it.

 

If the government needs patient's medical records to fight their war on terror, do you really think HIPPA will stop them, if the Constitution is insufficient to stop them? Wake up.

 

Like I said, if government security agencies can't catch potential terrorists without infringing on the rights of its law abiding citizens, they need to be replaced. I'd rather take my chances with Islamic lunatics than give away any more of my rights to the fucking US government - I'm an American, btw.

 

Sorry, fear is not a good thing when it results in the fear leading us to accept a loss of freedom.

 

Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.

~ Benjamin Franklin

 

So true.

The fallacy with your use of the Benjamin Franklin quote is that we are NOT giving up "ESSENTIAL" liberty. Not are we gaining TEMPORARY safety. We are gaining permanent safety.

 

If I was bothered by a breach of the HIPPA law on my medical records, I'd make a big fuss. So ?

 

My best guess would be that YES, the HIPPA law WOULD stop them, reason being the punishment under the HIPPA laws are very severe, and I haven't heard anything of them being violated, have you ?

 

I would not ever take ANY chances with Islamic lunatics, and especially not just to preserve a little privacy. And I don't see where anyone is giving up any rights. Your phone records are already out there being viewed by people in the phone co., who you don't know who they are, and the NSA thing was voted in by the US Congress, so what's the problem ?

 

Take chances with Islamic lunatics!!! Are you nuts ? :wacko:

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179765_472277779533395_15491212_n.jpg

 

This is why our Founders saw to it that we would be a Heavily Armed Nation, and a Force to be reckoned with..

 

That we may NEVER live in fear of Tyranny, Tyrants, or Terrorists...

Guess who the boot on us belongs too..... go ahead, guess...... ^_^

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He closed gitmo, he ended the iraq war, he ended the effing afghan war. He did everythi g he said he would do.

 

dano, I really get tired of correcting you, so for the last time....gitmo is still open; Bush signed the SOFA setting the timeline for troop withdrawal, Obama just followed orders; and we're still fighting in Afghanistan.

 

Either you have no concept of tense, you're a liar, or someone is lying to you and you're falling for it hook, line, and sinker.

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And the Democrats currently in power keep extending and expanding it. Go back to the bar and drink until you make sense to me.

Sorry, we can't make sense to someone who is senseless.

 

We warned all of you of this guy. We were called "racists", bigots, Nazis, homophobes, islamophobes, etc, by the left when we told you what this ass was all about. Now I get to say to all of you mean nasty leftists, I TOLD YOU SO.

Your side said plenty of bogus crap. So, you came up with a pretty penny of truth burried under a ton of horse sh1t? Yea, you guys are great.....

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Sorry, we can't make sense to someone who is senseless.

 

Your side said plenty of bogus crap. So, you came up with a pretty penny of truth burried under a ton of horse sh1t? Yea, you guys are great.....

 

He was complaining about the Patriot Act. I'm trying to figure out why, if it's so evil to Dems, they keep extending and expanding it.

 

Personally, I think it's a load of crap and should be repealed, but every once in a while you've got to have a little fun and poke the bear, ya know?

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Hannibal

Here's a partial list of the lies lies and more lies, I could find literally HUNDREDS MORE.

 

1- Halve the deficit by 2012: Obama’s biggest broken promise. Less than a month after taking office, the president decried the nation’s $1.3 trillion deficit and vowed to cut it in half by 2012. Yet the national debt has increased more during Obama’s first three-and-a-half years in office than it did during George W. Bush’s entire two-term presidency. Yesterday, the national debt topped $16 trillion, a staggering amount that keeps going up. President Obama blamed his failure to deliver his promise on his predecessor, correctly pointing out that Bush paid for two wars and a Medicare prescription drug program with borrowed cash. Obama also blamed the ongoing economic woes for his inability to halve the deficit. But he should have thought about unforeseen circumstances before making such a bold and, ultimately, undeliverable promise.

2- Hold Wall Street accountable: Obama has repeatedly pledged to “hold Wall Street accountable” for its myriad crimes against the global economy and the American people. But from day one he has done quite the opposite, picking top Wall Street executives and government officials responsible for destroying the economy to run his economic transition team and failing to bring any of the ‘banksters’ who made billions by destroying the livelihoods of millions of Americans to justice.

3- Public Option: The public health insurance option, in which a government-run health insurance agency would have competed with private health insurance companies to provide affordable health care to millions of Americans, was repeatedly touted by Obama as a necessary and essential part of any health care reform. Candidate Obama vowed that “any American will have the opportunity to enroll in [a] new public plan.” But the public option died an agonizing death, and while all the blame cannot be placed on the president, it was his willingness to compromise with Republicans, members of his own party and the insurance industry lobbyists who helped author the bill in order to get the watered-down measure passed into law that ultimately led to the public option being dead on arrival. The United States remains the only developed nation without single-payer, universal health care, and many thousands of Americans continue to die each year for lack of health insurance.

4- Close Guantánamo: Obama repeatedly vowed to close the US military prison camp at Guantánamo Bay, Cuba during his 2008 election campaign. One of the very first things he did after taking office was to issue an executive order requiring that the prison, infamous worldwide for torture and the deliberate imprisonment of hundreds of innocent men and boys, be closed within one year. Nearly four years later, GITMO remains a dark stain on America’s reputation.

5- Hold Bush war criminals accountable: President George W. Bush and many of his top officials, as well as top military and intelligence figures, planned, authorized or presided over the murder, torture, rape, unlawful execution, massacre and wrongful imprisonment of tens of thousands of individuals, most of them innocent, in the name of fighting terrorism. On the campaign trail, candidate Obama asserted that these crimes would be investigated. But once in office, not only did the president refuse to investigate or prosecute any of the Bush-era war criminals, he has repeatedly acted to protect them from justice. Just last week, final immunity was granted to Bush’s CIA torturers.

6- Begin withdrawal from Afghanistan by July 2011: The president promised to begin drawing down troops from what is now the longest war in US history by July 2011. That did not happen; the number of US troops in Afghanistan continued to rise and although it has since fallen slightly, more than 84,000 remain. More than 2,000 have been killed, along with tens of thousands of innocent Afghan men, women and children, while the Taliban remains a formidable foe in control of much of the country...............

 

Hannibal, I have always been a big fan of yours, but that last diatribe is bs. Most, if not all of the proceeding was attempted but stopped by the Republicans. Anything that wasn't stopped by the Republicans wasn't attempted because it would have been stopped by the Republicans. Holding Pres Bush responsible is not a duty of the president. If he prodded the AG to do so, he would have been rightfully condemned.

 

 

 

He was complaining about the Patriot Act. I'm trying to figure out why, if it's so evil to Dems, they keep extending and expanding it.

 

Personally, I think it's a load of crap and should be repealed, but every once in a while you've got to have a little fun and poke the bear, ya know?

 

 

I'm truly a liberal and therefore against everything Obama and Bush did in relationship to shredding the 4th amendment. I do, however, understand that purity of thought is the hallmark of naivete. I am not naive, so I believe we really don't know how important the Patriot Act is to our security. I usually leave this subject alone.

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I'm truly a liberal and therefore against everything Obama and Bush did in relationship to shredding the 4th amendment. I do, however, understand that purity of thought is the hallmark of naivete. I am not naive, so I believe we really don't know how important the Patriot Act is to our security. I usually leave this subject alone.

 

The Patriot Act was passed hastily, with the overwhelming majority of Congress (Democrats AND Republicans) voting for it - all in the name of "doing something" - without ever having read it. It was and is a travesty that never should have even been proposed, much less enacted into law in such a haphazard way.

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Hannibal

Here's a partial list of the lies lies and more lies, I could find literally HUNDREDS MORE.

 

1- Halve the deficit by 2012: Obama’s biggest broken promise. Less than a month after taking office, the president decried the nation’s $1.3 trillion deficit and vowed to cut it in half by 2012. Yet the national debt has increased more during Obama’s first three-and-a-half years in office than it did during George W. Bush’s entire two-term presidency. Yesterday, the national debt topped $16 trillion, a staggering amount that keeps going up. President Obama blamed his failure to deliver his promise on his predecessor, correctly pointing out that Bush paid for two wars and a Medicare prescription drug program with borrowed cash. Obama also blamed the ongoing economic woes for his inability to halve the deficit. But he should have thought about unforeseen circumstances before making such a bold and, ultimately, undeliverable promise.

2- Hold Wall Street accountable: Obama has repeatedly pledged to “hold Wall Street accountable” for its myriad crimes against the global economy and the American people. But from day one he has done quite the opposite, picking top Wall Street executives and government officials responsible for destroying the economy to run his economic transition team and failing to bring any of the ‘banksters’ who made billions by destroying the livelihoods of millions of Americans to justice.

3- Public Option: The public health insurance option, in which a government-run health insurance agency would have competed with private health insurance companies to provide affordable health care to millions of Americans, was repeatedly touted by Obama as a necessary and essential part of any health care reform. Candidate Obama vowed that “any American will have the opportunity to enroll in [a] new public plan.” But the public option died an agonizing death, and while all the blame cannot be placed on the president, it was his willingness to compromise with Republicans, members of his own party and the insurance industry lobbyists who helped author the bill in order to get the watered-down measure passed into law that ultimately led to the public option being dead on arrival. The United States remains the only developed nation without single-payer, universal health care, and many thousands of Americans continue to die each year for lack of health insurance.

4- Close Guantánamo: Obama repeatedly vowed to close the US military prison camp at Guantánamo Bay, Cuba during his 2008 election campaign. One of the very first things he did after taking office was to issue an executive order requiring that the prison, infamous worldwide for torture and the deliberate imprisonment of hundreds of innocent men and boys, be closed within one year. Nearly four years later, GITMO remains a dark stain on America’s reputation.

5- Hold Bush war criminals accountable: President George W. Bush and many of his top officials, as well as top military and intelligence figures, planned, authorized or presided over the murder, torture, rape, unlawful execution, massacre and wrongful imprisonment of tens of thousands of individuals, most of them innocent, in the name of fighting terrorism. On the campaign trail, candidate Obama asserted that these crimes would be investigated. But once in office, not only did the president refuse to investigate or prosecute any of the Bush-era war criminals, he has repeatedly acted to protect them from justice. Just last week, final immunity was granted to Bush’s CIA torturers.

6- Begin withdrawal from Afghanistan by July 2011: The president promised to begin drawing down troops from what is now the longest war in US history by July 2011. That did not happen; the number of US troops in Afghanistan continued to rise and although it has since fallen slightly, more than 84,000 remain. More than 2,000 have been killed, along with tens of thousands of innocent Afghan men, women and children, while the Taliban remains a formidable foe in control of much of the country...............

 

Hannibal, I have always been a big fan of yours, but that last diatribe is bs. Most, if not all of the proceeding was attempted but stopped by the Republicans. Anything that wasn't stopped by the Republicans wasn't attempted because it would have been stopped by the Republicans. Holding Pres Bush responsible is not a duty of the president. If he prodded the AG to do so, he would have been rightfully condemned.

 

 

 

 

I'm truly a liberal and therefore against everything Obama and Bush did in relationship to shredding the 4th amendment. I do, however, understand that purity of thought is the hallmark of naivete. I am not naive, so I believe we really don't know how important the Patriot Act is to our security. I usually leave this subject alone.

I am simply saying that there is very little different these days, I feel partisanship is for fools at this point, our government isn't ours anymore and hasn't been for some time. Can you really disagree with this !? :huh:

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All good.

 

 

You were supporting the economy like the rest of us. Good on ya. How is Bush so different than Obama? They're one and the same. That's why I said wake up. Bush increased the debt 4 trillion and change in 8 years. Obama has increased the debt 7 trillion in 5. Bush got us into two wars that could have been handled with Spec Ops forces, but they weren't that robust at the time. Obama has kept one going and expanded his drone strike authority. WAKE UP! NO DIFFERENCE! One instituted the Patriot Act, the other kept it going and expanded presidential power with the NDAA. WAKE UP!! NO DIFFERENCE!!! Blind faith in our leaders is wrong, bottom line.

 

 

He was president for a few months. What did he do besides be half black? He supported the overthrow of several legitimate, albeit unfriendly, governments. His drone attacks kill indiscriminately. Pakistan has had it with them. He's killed US citizens who we "think" were a threat to the US without due process. You can't be that stupid.

 

 

Well no kidding. They're on the opposite end of the political spectrum. Just like the left wanted Bush to fail, they want Obama to fail. It's called politics. It's also wrong as hell for anyone to do it. Your side called Bush every name in the book and painted him as the anti-Christ. The right does the same for Obama, but holy crap, I've never seen idol worship like I do with this guy. Seriously? The president's face on a t-shirt? Where's the dignity of our highest office? WAKE UP! When you realize what I'm saying, you'll know what I mean.

 

 

 

Actually Clinton deregulated the banks before he left office which caused the housing bubble to burst. Glassman-Steagall Act I think. Don't quote me on the actual name. Bush got the "credit" for it. But that wasn't what I was referring to. I was referring to all those people who quit their jobs, etc. to attend the inaugaration saying Obama was going to pay their bills because they were black. It was all over the news and now it's all over Youtube. How ignorant can you be to assume that? (not you, them)

 

 

Don't even need to check the link. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you posted the actual story behind the Obamaphones. My point was that the constant idol worship of this guy is just wrong. He can lead you to a cliff like a bunch of lemmings and convince you to jump because he said it.

 

 

You don't understand what I'm saying. When you do, you'll know what I mean.

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... the Nobel Peace prize was announced in Oslo on October 9, 2009... it seems

that I am dreaming that the gestation period for human offspring is now just a "few" months.

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... Bush didn't say he wasn't concerned about Osama bin Laden six months after

9/11 (less than a "few"? Would that be a "couple" of months?). No, 9/11 didn't look like the "new Pearl Harbor"

"prize" in the PNAC's "Rebuilding America's Defenses" at all.

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... Bush got two wars and related legislation along with a severely crashed economy to pay for just like Obama got from Bush.

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... Obama didn't say, " I have signed the Act chiefly because it authorizes

funding for the defense of the United States and its interests abroad, crucial services for service members and

their families, and vital national security programs that must be renewed" over H.R. 1540 (NDAA).

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... Republican obstructionism hasn't been obvious toward keeping the status quo of the previous president.

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... Bush went all out to change from a peacetime to a wartime economy and

removed/changed laws from/on the books to guard against the bankruptcy our enemy aimed for. Therefore people didn't have extra money to invest in a hot item like housing because there were no tax cuts and Glass Steagall was re-instituted in response to the change from peacetime to wartime.

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... Osama bin Laden didn't go to his death seeing the US in at the edge of bankruptcy and in severe political turmoil... so weakened that protections like FISA, NSA, the PATRIOT ACT, and elements in the NDAA against a final blow would be necessary but cause civil unrest. No... Bush was much more clever than Osama bin Laden and bin Laden died with his foolish predictions of what his efforts would do.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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The Patriot Act was passed hastily, with the overwhelming majority of Congress (Democrats AND Republicans) voting for it - all in the name of "doing something" - without ever having read it. It was and is a travesty that never should have even been proposed, much less enacted into law in such a haphazard way.

More like "doing something" quickly. That "something" involve a nationalism brought on by 9/11.

 

Here we have a knowing excerpt from "Rebuilding America's Defenses" (available on the internet since September 2000)

 

 

Further, the process of transformation,

even if it brings revolutionary change, is

likely to be a long one, absent some

catastrophic and catalyzing event – like a

new Pearl Harbor. Domestic politics and

industrial policy will shape the pace and

content of transformation as much as the

requirements of current missions.

 

Osama bin Laden gave us the "new Pearl Harbor" and Bush followed "Rebuilding America's Defenses" blueprint. The rest is history!!!

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This is why our Founders saw to it that we would be a Heavily Armed Nation, and a Force to be reckoned with..

 

That we may NEVER live in fear of Tyranny, Tyrants, or Terrorists...

And that is what irks the dimocrats so much, they want to be ruled by a tyrant, they want their freedoms taken away because they're dumb as sheep.

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Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... the Nobel Peace prize was announced in Oslo on October 9, 2009... it seems

that I am dreaming that the gestation period for human offspring is now just a "few" months.

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... Bush didn't say he wasn't concerned about Osama bin Laden six months after

9/11 (less than a "few"? Would that be a "couple" of months?). No, 9/11 didn't look like the "new Pearl Harbor"

"prize" in the PNAC's "Rebuilding America's Defenses" at all.

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... Bush got two wars and related legislation along with a severely crashed economy to pay for just like Obama got from Bush.

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... Obama didn't say, " I have signed the Act chiefly because it authorizes

funding for the defense of the United States and its interests abroad, crucial services for service members and

their families, and vital national security programs that must be renewed" over H.R. 1540 (NDAA).

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... Republican obstructionism hasn't been obvious toward keeping the status quo of the previous president.

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... Bush went all out to change from a peacetime to a wartime economy and

removed/changed laws from/on the books to guard against the bankruptcy our enemy aimed for. Therefore people didn't have extra money to invest in a hot item like housing because there were no tax cuts and Glass Steagall was re-instituted in response to the change from peacetime to wartime.

 

Yes, I must be sleeping/dreaming... Osama bin Laden didn't go to his death seeing the US in at the edge of bankruptcy and in severe political turmoil... so weakened that protections like FISA, NSA, the PATRIOT ACT, and elements in the NDAA against a final blow would be necessary but cause civil unrest. No... Bush was much more clever than Osama bin Laden and bin Laden died with his foolish predictions of what his efforts would do.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

there ya go! Now if you'll only realize that Obama and Bush are the same thing with a different packaging and branding, you'll see what I'm talking about. I'm not defending anything that Bush has done, I'm merely pointing out the flaws in blind faith in Obama, which seems to be an epidemic.

 

We may be saying the same thing just looking at it from a different lens.

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there ya go! Now if you'll only realize that Obama and Bush are the same thing with a different packaging and branding, you'll see what I'm talking about. I'm not defending anything that Bush has done, I'm merely pointing out the flaws in blind faith in Obama, which seems to be an epidemic.

 

We may be saying the same thing just looking at it from a different lens.

 

I was a registered Republican... Reaganomics screwed me... and I subsequently lost my best jobs under both Bushes. While I personally hold on to many Conservative ways, the Republican Party showed me that they only wanted my vote. Yes, I know that in the current paradigm the Democrat Party plays roughly the same game... and that is why I am, still, not registered to any party.

 

I watched as the Republicans played obstructionism and "Lewinsky scandal" on Clinton's relatively comfortable period for the US to get themselves back in. To do what? Premeditated war/hubris driven economy?

 

Perhaps it looks like I am following a "once bitten, twice shy" routine, but since the Reaganomics catastrophe is in play for me it is more like a "twice bitten, now I'm biting back" thing.

 

My defence of Obama is not a blind faith/unconditional love thing... it is more like recognizing the actual lesser evil in a good-cop/bad-cop dyad.

 

(Just another observation... "good-cop/bad-cop" in the police world is usually played toward a good outcome for the general populous, but when good people are harvested for their votes only to get a person into office to play "good-cop/bad-cop" for the purposes of special interests... then you get something that looks like our current government.)

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Hannibal

. I am not naive, so I believe we really don't know how important the Patriot Act is to our security. I usually leave this subject alone.

 

When you speak intelligently, I give you credit. Good post. And the American people agree with you 2 to 1. Click the link.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/wp/2013/06/11/security-privacy-in-1-poll-question/

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When you speak intelligently, I give you credit. Good post. And the American people agree with you 2 to 1. Click the link.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/wp/2013/06/11/security-privacy-in-1-poll-question/

The poll is meaningless. Contrary to popular belief, we live in a Constitutional Republic. Not mob rule.

 

 

Meaning that our Constitutional Rights trump what the masses may, and or may want. One of the reasons the founders set it up that way, so that our rights would preserved, regardless. I think our founders knew, and or experienced times when Government, and or media would use fear in an attempt to take their god given rights away.

that is exactly what our Government, and Corporate Government controlled media is doing today. Using fear, and fear based propaganda to take our civil rights away.

 

Sheep suck it right up..

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Maybe we need the government to mandate that we all have cameras in all of rooms in our homes too.

 

Sheep still have not figured out that the Patriot Act was meant to use on the American people. Not terrorists.

 

 

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